"REAL otherkin dont use nounself pronouns" bye
I really don’t see the problem with nounself pronouns
Seriously, could someone calmly care to explain and discus it?
They’re grammatically unsound and don’t really have a functional purpose. Alternative pronouns are necessary where neither the male nor female pronouns can be used. This usage is more official including the use of the “hir” or “xir” set of pronouns for trans or non-binary individuals (something I’ve actually seen in publications when necessary). Nounself pronouns are strictly a “tumblrkin” thing. Otherkin (and therians alike) outside of tumblr have never even suggested the use of alternate pronouns for their kin selves, let alone use them (and if they are, I can almost gaurantee that they got the idea from tumblr; the idea that the nounself thing was started by a troll is quite believable to me).
Nounself pronouns function much like a nickname as there are so many and people can invent them all the time. We invent names, not basic parts of grammer. Sure, language evolves, but only as functionally necessary and in a widespread manner. As many have said, the state of being otherkin is not a gender, so don’t (grammatically) treat it like it is by replacing gender-based pronouns with kin-based nouns…that makes them sound like awkward nicknames.
Seeing these all over the profiles of the otherkin and therians look silly and immature to me, and probably look that way to many other otherkin who were in the otherkin or therian community for a while before finding “tumblrkin” which look like a whole different “breed” to me. The nounself thing is only the icing to the cake that is the oddity of the tumblr variety of kin, imo.
Ever wonder why the Toxic One is always up in arms about Dandelion eating, sitting on toad-stool, Forest Frolicking elves? Read on and learn. Basically, that Tolkien, D&D, and popular folklore image reinforces many negative points. Firstly, it promotes the idea that elves can only live happily in non-urban environments. Bullcrap. All women will agree with me that indoor plumbing is the mark of a truly civilized society. Secondly, there is the problem of this being the “human’s world”. Yeah, right. We share this world with them and quite frankly it is the choosing to let human outlooks and judgment bother you that is the problem. This is home. Honestly there is little else I can see to happiness besides good friends, good drink, shelter, and good woman in your bed. Lastly, it encourages too much of a group mentality. I don’t believe that elven hive mentality is healthy. All these things can be achieved here if you look and try and don’t give up. In general, the classical elven/fae paradigm promotes a lot of unhealthy ideas that can depress ya pretty bad.
Hey, There’s Mud in My Boxers by Kyrin.
[some typos and grammatical errors corrected]
I disagree with Tolkien’s elves being included in this. If you read any of Tolkien’s works, especially the Silmarillion, you will see that they are not simple, forest-dwelling, ‘frolicking’ elves. They are complex, highly intelligent, and vastly civilized creatures who live in advanced societies of many different kinds. They aren’t by any stretch of the imagination a ‘hive-mind’ and I’m not even sure what would give anyone that impression. They are all individuals with emotions and hardships (a LOT of hardships) and to pass them off as a hive-mind is actually incredibly disrespectful to Tolkien. Lastly, let’s be real. If we’re going by what Tolkien wrote, this was once the Elves’ world, and now it’s the humans’ world, and we fucked it up pretty thoroughly.
Yeah… I had some issues with that as well. I <i>think</i> this is speaking of the romanticization of nature and “better than humans” mentality that can sometimes crop up in otherkin circles… (I believe this is from an otherkin website) and a “living in “the past” instead of focusing on the now” focus - which can create a bit of a hivemind if you’re not careful. I’m reading it as a warning against putting on an identity and escapism, which is mostly why I reblogged it… to be honest, I wasn’t going to reblog it when I first saw it yesterday, I didn’t like the Tolkien aspect that melkorsgirl spoke of, or the “a good woman in your bed” part…
Yeah, I posted it knowing that most depictions of elves are usually more complex, but I don’t think a lot of people tend to consider that and end up thinking simplistically and not really thinking about what elves mean to them (which is really more important then worrying if you’re fitting into a mould…). I didn’t like the whole ‘woman in your bed’ part either, but it’s posted knowingly that it’s really from the perspective of the writer, and under the probably uneducated generalisations and sexual overtones, there’s something I felt was worth posting. :)
That’s… yeah… reeeally the perspective of the writer, who is a unique character. I would not refer to them as “uneducated generalizations” — it’s not that he lacked exposure or was a noob (except inasmuch as when the online community was itself newer, we were all less experienced in it), but he is quite outspoken about his ungentle views. He’s not a bad dude all in all, but also not called “The Toxic Elf” for nothing. I saw a post somewhere recently about Avari elves and how Tolkien was focused on the Eldar; one could think of this as something like a similar type of “view from the other side” (although I highly doubt Kyrin would refer to himself as “Avari”!).
tbh I think there should be an easy way of telling if someone’s talking about otherkin as in “I feel spiritually connected to this” and otherkin as in “i feel as if i as this in a past life/have the soul of this” because it’s confusing as hell tbh.
Kind of like when you’re having a discussion with a pagan and then you realize they’re pantheist or soft polytheist and you’re hard polytheist.
sub-labels are good. not knocking one viewpoint or the other but man it’s confusing trying to talk to other kin.
like maybe animus kin and non-animus kin?
And it’s for this exact reason that I dislike the “identifies with” crowd using the term otherkin, because otherkin has always meant to identify AS nonhuman. It’s more than just being connected to something, it’s actually BEING that thing on a nonphysical level. It’s not identity policing, but making sure that people use the right words to describe their experiences so they can relate to one another.
Okay, tell me if I’m wrong, but haven’t two labels already been invented for those who are “connected with” or “identifies with”, but do not identify as?
- Animal-hearted (tiger-hearted, rabbit-hearted etc), is for those who have a strong connection to a species but don’t consider themselves to actually BE that species (i.e. are not therians)
- Elementweavers (fireweaver, spaceweaver, etc), for those with a strong connection a certain element or concept. I’ve only seen this used on tumblr so far, but I think it could make a nifty label.
So please, if you do not identify as a non-human creature, do not call yourself otherkin or therian, even if you have a spiritual connection to it or identify with it.
I’ve never heard of the “-weaver” formation in this context, but if it’s something that itself arose on tumblr, perhaps I wouldn’t have. Couldn’t the “-hearted” terms work as well for mythic or abstract things? (Elvenhearted, firehearted…) There’s also “Fae-touched” and the lesser known “faeid” for those particular things.
it might be a good idea to just ignore theangrylionshark from now on. they do a lot of identity policing and it's pretty gross, and bringing that onto this blog makes it seem sort of unsafe here. it's nothing against you guys, just that person.
yeah, i. i’m a new mod but i’ve noticed theangrylionshark seems to have a lot of issues with otherkin who dont identify exactly how they feel they should.
this is my own personal opinion, but i believe that being otherkin doesnt always have to mean identifyin 100% as something other than human. it definitely isnt just liking something or an animal, obviously, but it can be experienced in multiple ways. its not just liking something or even merely just a slight connection, but if someone feels genuinely and deeply connected to something to point of viewing it as an integral part of their identity, who am i to say they cant use the otherkin label just because they dont feel they are that thing completely and utterly?? if the label of otherkin makes them feel right and comfortable, thats none of my business.
so long as they arent hurting anyone, i see no reason to hurt them.
i urge all my fellow mods to avoid responding to theangrylionshark from now on.
The word “otherkin” has had a set definition for over 20 years. You can either use it as defined or find a new term. It isn’t identity policing to uphold established terminology. People don’t get to re-define or ignore the given definition because they feel like it. It is damaging to the otherkin community as a whole to do so.
Why are folks so attached to the label? If the original definition doesn’t fit, it shouldn’t be detrimental to find/create a new one. There’s nothing terribly special about being otherkin (unless someone’s passing out free cookies to otherkin and otherkin only then I suppose I can understand the motive).
As much as I respect the motive of your blog, otherkinhelp, I can’t help but to agree that stretching the definition here is not helping. For one, the definition was not an opinion to begin with. Therefore, other opinions have no weight on that. Secondly, pulling the definition out this way is allowing the community as a whole to seem a lot more shallow than it really is. It’s a mature concept and it takes mature thought to finally realize that the label is appropriate. I expect people to jump into this in error only to find it didn’t fit and drop the label. What shouldn’t happen is for someone to take on the label in error and bend the definition to allow it to still work for them. I know this had been said before, but it should be noted that there are still plenty who agree with this notion other than theangrylionshark.
i remember seeing something somewhere about being princesskin, what would that be like? and is there a such thing as princekin?
hmm, i would think that it’d be like just about any royaltykin - which exists! so princekin is most likely a thing. i get the feeling that it might feel a little “lesser” compared to a king/queen/emperor, though (not that that’s a bad thing!)
*sigh* Okay, no it isn’t a thing…not if you identify as human royalty…that’s just having a superiority complex, really liking the feudal system, etc. Otherkin are people who identify as other than human so royalty-kin is not a thing. Now, if you identify as an elven prince/princess/whatever that’s a thing. If you identify as a fiction prince/princess/etc. that would make you fiction-kin, but if that fictional character is human you’d only be fiction-kin, not otherkin.
Oh my gods, princesses are not mythological beings! Princesses are human! I’m really, really hoping that some of these questions to otherkinhelp are trolls, throwing dumb at the wall and seeing what sticks. Sadly, most of it sticks at otherkinhelp.
Being nobility or royalty is a role, not a species. Come on now.
(For the record, “elven princess syndrome” is also a thing.)
I've recently realized that I'm felinekin and I've told my closest friends but I'm still not really comfortable with the idea Is there anyway that I could get more used to this?
Hello friend! An identity is there to bring you comfort, for the most part. If your identity doesn’t make you feel comfortable in yourself, than I think you should try to experiment with other identities. However, if you are uncomfortable about other people knowing and not so much your identity itself- I would tell you just not to tell people. If it is really important to you, go ahead. But if not, I would wait and tell people when your ready. For me my identity is more of a private thing, though your identity is not required to be like mine at all. :} You can tell everyone, you can keep it a secret, your identity is yours and no one can take it away if you truly feel it is you.
The biggest tip I can tell you is to take it slow. Wait until you are comfortable before you tell people, and before you even label yourself as a specific kin. I hope you find an identity that makes you feel comfortable and happy!
Identity is about knowing and understanding yourself. It is not about what makes you feel comfortable.
wow, its almost as if knowing and understanding oneself can make a person feel more comfortable with their identity.
I think the issue comes from yet one more misunderstanding over what identities are.
An identity is distinct from its identity label. They are not one and the same. An identity is an experience relating to the self. It’s a part of who you are, based on actual, lived experiences. It’s not something you can pick and choose at will.
Things you can pick and experiment with: identity labels, ie. terms to describe your experience; whether you fit in or not in a specific community; the particular perspective on your personal experience, in other words how you look at something.
So in short, you can’t experiment with “being a therian” or “being otherkin”. You can experiment with the label, research and see if it appropriately describes your experience. You cannot, however, try to be a therian or otherkin just to “see what it’s like”. Doesn’t happen.
I wish I could help the OP, but without knowing why the idea of “felinekin” isn’t something they’re comfortable with, it is difficult.
Deadkin/undeadkin here to confirm nonny's suspicions - deadkin is, in fact, a thing! :)
It is in fact not a thing.
Can anybody explain their experience to me regarding how deadkin/undeadkin identity exists? How is it possible to identify as a dead thing? In which ways it is different than identifying as a psychopomp creature? Do you have phantom sensations of being rotten? Just how does it work, in more than one sentence? I’m genuinely confused.
Hi! Im dragonkin but I also feel very connected to Halloween? Is there such a thing as halloweenkin as a whole? Like I love pumpkins, the night, and cool weather, ghosts, monsters everything about halloween! Is there such a thing to have a kin related to an event?
Hello friend! Your identity sounds so cool!
You would be an excellent Trick or Treat partner.Anyway! I have heard of The Nightmare Before Christmas kin (though it has been a year or two since we have had contact), though no general holidaykin. Any identity is possible, it all depends on your connection with it.
If you feel comfortable, I would personally love if you made a blog around your identity. A dragon halloweenkin blog sounds fabulous, especially if you wrote a few essays on your identity. It could even help people out there who may identify with other holidays to come forward.
Seriously with this “anything is possible” crap? How does one identify as a holiday? Seriously, how? I love Halloween, I am not Halloween. You’re a dragon-kin who really likes Halloween, there is no such thing as holiday-kin because one cannot identify as a holiday and a kintype is something one identifies as. We identify with holidays. A connection to something, doesn’t make it a kintype. End of story.
This is getting ridiculous. :l
oh my god okay so one day i kinda just decided to stop eating pork, and i’ve never really liked it much since then, its just not that good to me?? and today, just now, it clicked. i looked it up, and pork is bad for cats, and i also identify as felinekin.
Pork is usually…
===That said? An amusing observation regarding ‘kin out my way.
===Most that would be considered “unseelie” tend to be vegetarian…often due to issues involving just not being able to digest meat very well.
===The folks we jokingly call seelie…are far more carnivorous overall.
===(we use the seelie/unseelie terms as offhand reference joke, as really we do not use them more than tone terms…)
[dark] elf, vegetarian + fish, I don’t handle most meats very well… Another dark elf I know also has the same dietary preferences.
I think it’s fun observing these kinds of correlations, so long as one doesn’t take them with any particular degree of seriousness. :3
Husband and I are equally carnivores (well, omnivores) and one unseelie, one seelie, if forced into such terminology molds. If either of us ever has more vegetarian urges, it’s me, the seelie. Take that, anecdotal data!
The-fernlion, I got my “Fae are among you” button from the SF Bay Area Otherkin Meetup at Pantheacon ‘13. silveth always has the cutest buttons for attendees. :D
Heh, ya, I make a bunch of buttons with my buttonmaker and give them out for free… I keep meaning to do badge ribbons, which are a popular thing at PCon, but it’s like, under the current regime (heh) I never know until at least October and possibly December whether I will even have a room in the hotel and thus be able to host the meetup, and by then it’s pretty short notice to get ribbons… so I just have made badges.
Seeing all these people being like “hmm, I don’t know if I’m a therian” or “I don’t know if I’m otherkin”, “because I do feel this connection but I don’t feel this and that and you’re supposed to feel that, right?”, like I just can’t help but think that… If you were, say, a therian, since that’s what’s closest to heart for me - you’d know, you know? The identity sort of finds you rather than you seeking, searching, meditating, thinking and maybe finding.
I found the therian community because my mom read an article about a therian in the paper, and it somehow reminded her of me and she told me to read it - I read it and it fitted perfectly with my feelings and experiences. First finding and joining a community and then trying to find your theriotype seems kind of backwards to me.
I don’t want to make this sound like some exclusive club, and of course you can always do some soul searching and maybe if you’re kind of torn between species or some such, but if you have to actively look for a theriotype, chances are that you are not a therian. And that’s okay. But it’s not good to fool yourself into an identity.
I feel really dumb asking this...but but um i'm a wolf therian and does that mean i'm kind of part of the otherkin community?
Only if you want to be. I, for one do not identify as otherkin. I prefer the term therian and I present myself as part of the therian community. It’s your choice.
Mmm, well. You can choose to refer to yourself as “wolfkin/wolf otherkin” or whatever if you like that term better. But overall, there are some differences in worldview, internal experiences, personal mythology (or lack thereof), interests/needs between the therian and otherkin communities in general. There are connections and overlaps, and some common interests in some cases, but my personal experience is that whether (mythic) otherkin and therians can happily mix without awkward “hi, how is the weather” discussion dominating depends on what other commonalities the individuals share, rather than the simple fact of being not-human.
To all the kin out there, what is your purpose of identifying with/ understanding your kin type other that to understand yourself better or if you think its cool? :) I’m genuinely curious
I have found that… when people ask me about therianthropy - because I identify as a therian, not as kin - their questions often have one thing in common; they assume that it’s a choice. And they ask me why. And they ask me what the purpose is. And they ask me what I’m hoping to achieve through this, and let me make this as clear to everyone out there as I know how;
THERE IS NO ANSWER.
THERE IS NO PURPOSE.
THERE IS NO GOAL.
THERIANTHROPY IS NOT A CHOICE.
I did not choose to identify as (not “with”) a wolf. I did not choose to be this way, so your questions will lead nowhere, and you’re only going to begin to understand what this is when you let go of that idea, that there is a purpose.
I don’t think it’s cool. It can be fascinating, and it can be great, but it’s also extremely frustrating and tiring. But cool? No, it’s not particularly cool.
If it were a choice, I could turn it off. Which I wish I could sometimes. Some of the people I’ve had the misfortune of speaking with regarding this have asked me “why I don’t just stop”, or have told me to stop because “it’s ridiculous”. And yeah, it is, sometimes. But there’s not a single shit I can do about that. I wish I could because it would be convenient and it would spare me the debating with idiots as mentioned above - to just flick it like a switch. But I can’t, even if you think it’s ridiculous. No matter how much time you spend yelling at a rock to stop being a rock, the rock won’t change.
So the next time you’re going to open your mouth to convince some unfortunate therian that their identity is ridiculous and that they should just stop “because that is some 7th grade shit right there”, I want you to think of them as a fucking rock, if that makes things easier for you to grasp.
All of this really could apply to otherkin as well.